Episode 45: A Kiss From A Rose
Episode 45 of The Descent Is Easy discusses A Kiss From A Rose, Episode 14 of Season 3 of Shadowhunters.
Things really get going in this episode and we love love love so many of the things put in motion… we just wished that someone had stopped to write any reasons to why 97% of things in this episode are happening. But we LOVE the things.
Come talk to us on Twitter and Tumblr, or email us and please review us on iTunes. Don’t forget to join our Quote Guessing Game!
24th March 2019 @ 11:53 pm
This episode was so much better than the previous one! There’s so much to like.
I liked the Clace scenes so much more, despite the obvious lack of bedhead. 😁 The whole ice skating date was adorable, it’s nice to finally see them do normal couple-y stuff for a change.
I like possesed Jace, Dom does the subtle differences between Jace and JJ so well. Didn’t like how long it took Clary to figure out that something was wrong though. But the whole thing with the rose was very clever. When JJ kissed Clary, I literally put a hand over my eyes and went ewww. 😂
Alisha was so good all through this episode! She is such an amazing character. I liked all her scenes with Jordan. I have no problem with the thought of them getting back together, I pretty much thought they were going to from the first time he showed up. I understand the controversy but I view him as a changed person. He’s going through a redemption arc and I like the fact that he is obviously working on being a better person. What I didn’t like was Maia apologizing to him for her behaviour towards him after everything that happened between them. That was just wrong. She did nothing wrong, all her feelings and reactions were perfectly valid. If she wants to forgive him, more power to her. But they shouldn’t have made her apologise.
Werewolf question, they can be killed by silver? Isn’t it a bit dangerous for Maia to be wearing a silver necklace then? How about earrings? Would they just give her a nasty infection? 😁
Can I just say that I’m thrilled that the show seems to have some kind of fondness for Belgium? On behalf of my people, we are very grateful.
Lorenzo is vile, ugh… I hope he redeems himself in some way before the end of the season. I like how frenetic Magnus is now that he has his magic back. It’s like he’s overcompensating or something. I like how Alec is pleased for him yet still cautious and worried cause he knows something is up. Protective Alec is everything. I didn’t mind him threatning Lorenzo with The Clave. He would never go through with that but i don’t mind him using whatever he can to worry Lorenzo. And he did seem a bit unnerved by the end. And yes, it’s hard for Magnus to lose his appartment but he can always start over somewhere again. But my heart breaks for Alec a bit as he does consider the appartment his home..
Loved, loved, LOVED Magnus’ speech about what his magic means to him, that was so good.
Uhm, don’t you have to have to have knowledge of a place before you can portal there? So has Magnus been to that cemetary before?
Underhill!! 😍
I hope that Luke has a cunning plan and that’s why he allowed himself to be arrested.. 😩
I think I have it worked out. Alec’s been on a saving spree since he became head of the institute. He convinced Magnus to provide him with all the candles he could ever want, thus saving a huge amount on the Institute’s electricity bill. Hence the perpetual darkness and abundance of candlelight. 😉
6th April 2019 @ 1:01 pm
Sorry for lateness.
I don’t have an issue with the idea that Maia and Jordan get back together because yes, he’s literally dedicated his life to changing himself and doing better, than what he did when he was with her and he absolutely is a changed character, I agree.
But yes, as you said. Maia apologising to him is literally just offensive. And I could have passed it, if we’d seen them in the next episode, where he figured all was forgiven and she turned around and explained that you say a lot of things when you think someone is dying, it doesn’t mean it’s true, and then they could have worked through their problems. But I genuinly think all is forgiven and that’s not ok. Espcially because the TV show keeps forgetting that the problem isn’t that he turned into a werewolf, scratched her, and then left her when he was ashamed and guilty and not himself. The problem is that he was an aggressive, possessive, jealous creep to her, and she broke up with him, way before that happened, and he stalked her, confronted her (again, incredibly aggressively) and THEN stalked her some more and scratched and turned her into a werewolf.
and yeah, she can forgive him for that, that’s absolutely her choice. but she seems to have forgotten it happened. and that’s what pisses me off 🙁
I’m not sure we’ve got anything about skin contact and silver in the show, actually. we’ve got valentine saying to luke that he should have brought a silver dagger, and of course we now have jordan being stabbed with silver blades. but that’s all internal and they even call is silver poisoning. so it’s entirely possible that skin contact isn’t enough to do anything… in the book they have silver powder that you throw on the skin of a werewolf and it burns them, much like holy water. but I don’t think we have any indication of that being the same in the show verse.
–Uhm, don’t you have to have to have knowledge of a place before you can portal there? So has Magnus been to that cemetary before?–
huh. fair point. that is what S1 tells us… It’s entirely possible that Magnus has been there before I suppose He’s been loads of places. I bet he has been to Belgium so even if he hasn’t been inside the cemetary, he may have enough knowledge of belgium and its layout to know exactly where the cemetery is located and I think all you need to portal is being able to visualise it. so it could be enough?
24th March 2019 @ 7:22 pm
also OH. MY GODS. YES. HOW VERY DARE YOU MAKE MAIA SAY SORRY TOHER ABUSER. HOW VERY DARE YOU. THATS AS BAD THAN THE CONSENT ISSUE THAT YOU MADE FOR MALEC FOR NO REASON AND THE SAPHEAL THING THAT WAS NON CONSESUAL AND SO WRONG. HOW DARE YOU.
AND HOW DARE THE FANDOM ONLY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH MALEC (again, special treatment for malec. ghghghghgh. call it out for it ALL. no, but i do love malec dont get me wrong, but still). I HATED ALL THOSE SCENES FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN THE ISSUE THEY MADE (MANY FOR /NO/ REASON.
😠
DONE. SO DONE
6th April 2019 @ 12:51 pm
I really wonder where they are going with Maia. it’s so interesting that Alisha has said in interview just how happy she is with where they ended the story and that Todd told her, what they would have done with her storyline, had she been available for the 2 finale episodes, and while she loved that, too, she also loved what they did do and… I just don’t know!!
24th March 2019 @ 7:17 pm
Ah yes, bedheads or the lack thereof. its like those amazing makeup removal commercials where the moldel removes her makeup to reveal a lighter makeup underneath. ugh. sh has had bedheads though- alec had it in 3.12 i believe? but yeah, clace should have had bad hair. but the thing is, they arent going to have it because clace is The Ship we all aspire to be (depite the appaling treatment they get). tbh, sizzy isnt. saia/saphael/jaia/melizzy isnt. because the thing is, malec is Other. and sh does fairly well on avoiding this, but malec is always going to be Other. (get ready for a long convo, 100000000 typos and also, some minor trc spoilers)
Representation is great! I love representation, and it’s amazing how Shadowhunters (the show, not the books, because though the books have some pretty good rep too, the show is far more diverse. Not that I dislike the books. I probably prefer the books to the show and the whole hangup fandom has over Books vs. Show, I find, is utter nonsense. But that’s a different conversation. Oh the wonders and dysfunction of fandoms that have two very very different mediums and such love for both and such hate for both. Its always easier with say, the PJO fandom, in which it’s unanimously agreed the movies suck.[they really, really do] But i digress) has such an effortless relation with it.
But, as Cassie Clare said on her Tumblr., fandom has a tendency to treat LGBT+, or PoC, or ‘strong’ females, as Other.
Fandom grips on to them with both hands, and says ‘oh my precious baby’ ‘must protect’ ‘so precious’. And that’s not bad. Not if you treat everyone like that. But oh-so-often it is towards minority groups. The incident Cassie talked about was how so many fans would ask: ‘is Alec a top or a bottom’. And she made a good point. It shouldn’t matter. And yeah, you may want it for fic, but if so, then why are you only asking about Malec. why not any hetero ship-because for hetero ships, its oh-so obvious-only it isnt? Shadowhunters isn’t the only fandom that does this. The Raven Cycle, for example, had a huge debate about whether Adam Parrish(you guessed it, part of a [RAVEN KING MINOR SPOILERS COS IF YOUVE SEEN FAN ART YOU WOULD PROBS KNOW THIS] homosexual ship) is a top or a bottom. And I understand why fandom tends to treat non-mainstream things like this. There has been so much lack of these things that any mention of it makes fandom sit up straight and go ‘you. i like you.’. and yeah, these characters are awesome. yeah, oh gods, love them, they deserve it. but dont treat them as Other. you can like them more, but please, please dont treat them as Other. because then you are saying that they are different because of x(gender/race/sexuality/etc), and please, please, dont do that (and so often, it happens w/o the negative connotations being realised? its really upsetting). and because malec is Other, they can be ‘normal’. cos a part of cassie/the show making them lgbt+ means that they are, in some small part there for relatability (which most characters are, but malec more so), so they HAVE to do thing that couples off screen do. and Other-ness normally sucks for malec, but in this case, it sucks for our other ships (though, tbh, ive kinda stopped caring about clace because of the show not caring- im not really gonna get content {though the skate date was awesome!!}). but yeah. if youre still here at the end of this mess, please tell me- do you agree? or am i just making stuff up and being over-cynical?
also on a lighter note, could jonathon feel them? could alec? cos im confused.
20th March 2019 @ 6:57 pm
So unlike last week I actually have things to say about this episode. I haven’t finished listening to the episode yet, but I am pretty sure that my biggest problem with this episode is what you are gonna talk about at the end of the episode so I’m just gonna comment now😂
Before I get to my problems with the episode I just want to say that I am so glad someone else has a problem with people on TV never having bedhead!! Not to make everything about Malec, but one of my favorite things about the bedroom scene in 3×12 was that both Magnus and Alec had messy hair and were actually covered in sweat and my only problem with Malec in 2×18 was that in the morning after scene Magnus’ hair, makeup, and jewelry were all perfectly in place😂 TV characters don’t have to be so perfectly put together all of the time and it makes scenes like that so much less realistic. So I’m glad they fixed that problem with 3×12, but then they ruined it with the Clace scene.
Speaking of Clace, this is the first episode since season 1 where I actually cared about Clace. That sounds kinda harsh, but none of their scenes, especially in season 3 have worked at all for me. I’m not gonna pretend like Clace has ever been my favorite couple in the show, but I still enjoy them when the writers remember that they have to develop them, and I was grinning like an idiot throughout the entire ice skating scene!! Kat and Dom did a great job and it was adorable!! I am sad for Clace fans that that is the only scene where they really got to be a normal couple and that I feel like its also gonna be the last. I may not really care that much for Clace as a couple, but I think about how I would feel if it was Malec and I feel really bad for them. It’s unfortunate.
So the Maia and Jordan in this episode. What are the writers doing? Alisha was so good in this episode, but I feel like Maia is so out of character and so different from how Maia has ever been that I am so just confused, and that’s beside the fact that what she is saying to Jordan is really not okay. I felt the same level of uncomfortableness that I felt watching that Sizzy scene in the Seelie Court and again I don’t know why the writers would go down this route with them. Maia doesn’t need to forgive Jordan for her not to want him to die and she definitely shouldn’t be blaming herself for everything he did to her. I think the show/writers think that they made all of Jordan’s possessive behavior because of his transformation and that’s not how it works or at all how I saw it, and even if it was that doesn’t make what Maia says any less problematic. Jordan was emotionally abusive and possessive of Maia and it has nothing to do with being a werewolf. I really don’t have the proper words to say because I am just so angry that they did this and as much as I love Chai, I wanted Jordan to die in this episode because I think that would have made some of what happened(slightly) better, but Maia apologizing to her abuser is inexcusable. (Slight possible spoiler next!!) And I don’t exactly know why they didn’t kill him because based on a quick shot from the 3B trailer I am almost 100% that he dies, possibly in the next episode. Maybe I am wrong, but we’ll see.
Despite all of that I actually really enjoyed this episode!! A lot more than last week and yes it had a lot to do with the lack of Heidi. Tessa Mossey is awesome, but Heidi really needs to stop taking up so much screen time.
Finally, the whole Jonathan thing this episode was creepy and weird, but “JJ” made me laugh every time you said it so thank you for that!!😂 This was another great episode and I can’t wait to listen next week!!
This is really long again and I’m sorry!! Also, it was indeed me that pointed out that Jonathan didn’t portal away at the end of 3×12 so you guys are good lol!
23rd March 2019 @ 2:29 pm
I loved the panting and sweating and messiness of 3×12. I may have had issues surrounding that episode and the build up and all sorts of things, but the pure ‘in the moment’ messiness that is sex? That was beautiful in that scene!!
I will give 2×18 a little bit of wiggle room, because magnus is awake, when we enter that scene, and he’s got magic, and it’s their first time and I am absolutely fine with him having magicked on his make up, and fixed his hair, before Alec woke up. it’s utterly head canon, but it’s sweet and therefore I’m ok with making that up. and he never took the necklaces off, and clearly they both just passed out after the sex, so i’m okay with the jewellery, too.
I don’t know whether you’ve seen the malec sneak peek for next week, so I’m not going to go into detail but all I’ve got to say is NO EXCUSE. no head canon. just grrr television perfection.
I think Clace, once again, is just being done dirty by the show, isn’t it? they’re your A couple and your perfect romantic fantasy, the thing that 14 year old girls look to, and therefore all of their kisses have to be back lit, their first time has to be in candle light, it all has to be romantic and soft and perfect. Clary would never be allowed to stumble over her own feet, trying to take her shoe off. and that’s such a shame, because it’s disarming and real and beautiful, and it makes you care.
And I think that’s what makes the ice skating scene so perfect and why you suddenly care (and I don’t disagree with you, I think it may be the first time I do, too) – because they are real people in that scene. they both have characters, and we see, what those characters are like, together. I don’t think we ever have before… and I fear you may be right. we may not get it again.
I genuinly do not know what the writers are doing with Maia and Jordan, no. I agree, I think they have decided the only issue is that Jordan turned her into a werewolf and conveniently forgot about the months before that, in which he was a jealous posssessive stalking creep… and that may work for your super casual shadowhunters watcher who is a bit fuzzy about what happened 18 months ago, but it’s not good enough.
I mean, the writing for the show has always been lacking, but they don’t normally mess up this much and i agree, I don’t have words for it but I also do not understand what the hell they are doing and yes, at least if Jordan had died, it would mean Maia would have to work through what just happened, and that could be interesting… this way, I’m just confused.
we talked about it more, post recording, and we just do not know. Ruth however did also suggest that maybe Jordan just dies next episode, rather than this episode.
again, not sure how much you’ve seen about next weeks epsiode…. I try to avoid sneak peeks and all, but it’s impossible to scroll through twitter and not have it. anyway. I totally agree. tessa mossey is lovely but heidi needs to stfu. though at least it looks like she’ll be in interesting places and with interesting people next week, so fingers crossed for that!!
–Also, it was indeed me that pointed out that Jonathan didn’t portal away at the end of 3×12 so you guys are good lol!–
damnit! I should have trusted my gut rather than hedging my bets hahaha
23rd March 2019 @ 7:39 pm
Ok, you actually changed my mind about Magnus’ hair and makeup in 2×18!! I forgot that he was awake before Alec because we come into the scene just as Alec wakes up so that makes sense now lol. And I don’t mind that he has a necklace on in that scene, I mostly just had a problem with the rings because they just look extremely large and uncomfortable to sleep in, but I just need to let that go😂 And yes I’ve watched the Malec sneak peek many many times, but the first time I watched it I immediately thought of you guys and your conversation in this episode haha. Alec Lightwood is the only character that gets to have bed head apparently *sigh*
I totally agree that the writers have tried to make Clace the “perfect romantic fantasy” and I think that reason that doesn’t work more than anything is that ALL of the other couples that are or have been on the show are so much more realistic. On some shows almost all of the couples are portrayed like Clace is and therefore it doesn’t stand out as much, but on Shadowhunters, you have Malec, Saia, Climon, Luke/Maryse(still don’t know what we’ve decided their ship name is lol), even Jace and Maia who just had a sexual relationship and they all seem much more genuine or realistic. And even though most of those relationships didn’t last I still enjoyed them in a way that I just don’t with Clace. Fingers crossed going forward, but I don’t have much hope or even care at this point, unfortunately.
What you said about the casual Shadowhunters watchers being ok with the Jordan and Maia is very true. From watching a bunch of reaction videos almost all of them thought that the Maia/Jordan scenes were so cute and amazing and I was just sitting there not understanding how they couldn’t see that this was not good. Like with Sizzy in 3×12, I hope they do something next episode that allows me to just forget that that part of this episode exists because it happened and there is nothing we can do about it now. All I can hope for is that they don’t make it worse because Maia is my favorite female character and she already doesn’t get enough screentime and they better use the time she does get wisely moving forward.
Regarding Heidi, yes I have seen that sneak peek as well and I am all for an interesting storyline involving her as long as she doesn’t get more screentime than our 8 main characters lol
To wrap this up I just want to thank you for being able to have adult conversations about this stuff, especially involving Clace or any of the relationships! If I tried to talk about this stuff on Twitter I would immediately be attacked and accused of all sorts of fun things just for stating my opinion and sometimes I just need to vent about this stuff so thank you!!
6th April 2019 @ 12:47 pm
wow, soooo late with this response ::facepalm::
I completely agree in regards to the rings in the 2.18 morning scene. Especially as I’m fairly sure it’s more rings than Magnus has EVER worn. because we get the hand holding in 3.2 and of course they don’t interlace fingers, so it’s always going to look different but I could have sworn he wears way less rings then.
Though at least the really ugly MASSIVE lightwood family ring is going to fit right into Magnus’ general ring-style, which is something at least. If someone proposed to me with that thing, I’d be flattered, then ask for a different ring hahaha
–From watching a bunch of reaction videos almost all of them thought that the Maia/Jordan scenes were so cute and amazing–
Oh wow. I hadn’t thought that would be the case. I don’t watch reaction videos, as I mostly get really annoyed with the constant pausing and screaming. I get the appeal and I have tried to get into reaction videos more times than I care to admit, but I just can’t seem to find anyone I like, as a gateway drug lol
But yeah, didn’t expect the majority of reactions to actually because about that scene being awesome… that’s a bit worrying.
Like, to a TINY degree I think it can be excused with the instant reaction to a scene, before you’ve thought back on what happened more than a year ago, and what those characters did to each other, and remembered the details of it all and realised that it’s maybe not cute… but still. =/
–To wrap this up I just want to thank you for being able to have adult conversations about this stuff, especially involving Clace or any of the relationships! If I tried to talk about this stuff on Twitter I would immediately be attacked and accused of all sorts of fun things just for stating my opinion and sometimes I just need to vent about this stuff so thank you!!–
ALWAYS!! hopefully with a less insane delay in future! mostly I tend to read and reply to comments on here, on my laptop, rather than my phone. and I’ve not been using my laptop a lot lately, hence the insane delay in actually commenting. But always happy to chat on twitter DMs or tumblr messages or anything else, too!
I think it’s so important to be able to discuss this stuff critically, without having stans jump down your throat because you dared to say a negative thing about a character or a couple, cause guess what? nobody is perfect. certainly nobody on shadowhunters.
so yeah. always happy to listen and rant right alongside you!! 😀
7th April 2019 @ 2:58 am
I’m glad I’m not the only one who thought the Lightwood ring was ugly and way too big!! I have a Lightwood ring that I bought online a while back and they should have gone for something like that because it’s not the prettiest ring I’ve ever seen, but it is not as ridiculously huge😂. However, most of the fandom seems to think that its the prettiest thing ever made so what do I know lmao. Maybe that’s just an engagement ring and they will go and get different wedding rings!!
Tbh I’m not entirely sure why I watch reactions videos sometimes. There are only like 2 who I actually consistently like watching for SH, and the rest are a little annoying but I can’t stop myself lmao. I don’t know, it’s complicated. Anyways, I think most of the reactors are casual viewers and just don’t remember certain things, especially when the hiatus between half seasons is 9 months long, but it just frustrates me that very few people in the fandom even, seem to be upset about this. I am going to be watching all Maia scenes(when she is actually in an episode)through my fingers just waiting for the writers to make things worse and I hate that because I really love Maia.
No need to apologize for delays on the responses! I could vent about Shadowhunters all day every day so respond whenever you have time!
9th April 2019 @ 3:51 pm
Malec tinted glasses? I get that the Lightwood ring has to be of a style with the Morgenstern and Herondale rings we’ve already seen. but blergh.
11th April 2019 @ 3:41 am
Yes! You guys talked about this in your 3×17 podcast and I do get it, but the Lightwood ring is, or at least looks, so much bigger and clunkier than the other ones!! And even Magnus who has a lot of large rings needs to politely tell Alec that they really need to go ring shopping!😂
16th April 2019 @ 11:33 am
I mostly just think it looks like it would be super painful to wear, with all it’s hexagonal edges!!
20th March 2019 @ 4:14 pm
He CLEARLY got his piercing by stabbing himself in the ear because he’s a psycho and Clary didn’t feel it because continuity issues and he’s found an earing that Clary dropped when SHE was living in the Apartment of Doom and Also Incest. Obviously.