Episode III.XI – The Sorcerer’s Shadow
Join us for The Sorcerer’s Shadow, epsiode 11 of Season 3 of BBC Merlin
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12th April 2021 @ 9:29 pm
I really love the discussion of Sorcerer’s Shadow, and I think the discussion of Merlin’s and Gaius’s complicity in Uther’s reign of terror is really important. It totally went over my head the first time I watched the series (ha, I was so young, but I also only realized from your discussion of the goblin episode that the goblins in Harry Potter are antiemetic, so a lot of stuff goes over my head. On the bright side, your discussions are helping me better see problematic portrayals in other fandoms and be more aware!).
Anyway, I’m dropping in way late again here just to say that everyone made really good points about Sorcerer’s Shadow and I wanted to connect the discussion to Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. DS9 has some really interesting discussions about people the Bajorans call “collaborators,” and those discussions come from a very different place of sympathy than what we’re seeing (as of 3.11) with Gaius and Merlin. One of DS9’s main POV characters when issues of genocide and complicity come up is Major Kira, who was a rebel fighter against a genocidal regime. She has little sympathy for collaborators and emphasizes their complicity in a way that the show Merlin de-emphasizes it. While Merlin (show) sides with Merlin (warlock) in wanting to protect Uther and defending his actions with “I had no choice,” and hasn’t yet called Gaius out on his gaslighting (among other things), DS9 is a lot more willing to wrestle with those issues, even if they don’t have clean solutions. I think I better appreciate the discussion of Merlin for having watched DS9, and I think it would be interesting to pair those shows and watch them more-or-less simultaneously, if anyone is…I don’t know, looking for a further quarantine activity or something. The genocide in DS9 isn’t completely similar to the oppression of magic in Camelot, but I think the comparisons and contrasts are useful.
24th January 2021 @ 11:22 pm
I do love your podcasts! But I really disagree with your take on this episode. I was immensely frustrated by the end of it because I think Gilli was right before the last head-exploding bit. Merlin was a coward in many ways, helping a tyrant to kill people because they didn’t fit into Merlin’s destiny focus. If you have magic and don’t use it to defend yourself or others, what the heck good is it? Merlin was living like a shadow because he thought he had a higher purpose but to me it seemed that all he did was kill people to keep Arthur safe and not much else. He kept talking a good game and promising the magical people that it would be great someday but he wasn’t doing anything to help that at all.
It was this episode where I finally started to wonder whether Merlin was the hero at all in the show. He lied to Arthur all the time, refused to give him information to make good decisions, manipulated him into decisions that Merlin wanted, killed or allowed others to be killed when he could have helped them, then complained about being a shadow and lonely. I love Merlin, I do but I just wanted to slap some sense into him and make him sit in the corner and think about what he’s doing.
His whole speech, emotional as it was and Colin was amazing in it, just drove me crazy. Like he was some kind of freedom fighter who forgot what he was fighting about and just killing people because he was on auto-pilot and they were the enemy even when they weren’t. So I try to forget this episode as much as I can.
29th November 2020 @ 12:43 am
I’m slowly catching up on episodes… masters degrees are exhausting!
So it’s late and my brain is fried from essay-writing and such, so I apologize if this doesn’t make sense or if I’m repeating something you already said, but the discussion about Merlin’s choice in how he reveals his magic to Gilly made me think of something: I think it’s really telling that when Merlin uses magic in service of Arthur it’s that blunt force you talked about, it’s violent, but when he uses it for himself or for others in a non-defensive way it’s these small, controlled, beautiful ways. If left to his own devices, Merlin would be making his chores easier, making smoke horses, little fires, etc. Destiny, supposedly the entire reason for his magic, is what makes him violent. So that’s sad as hell.
Overall I really really like this episode; my only real gripe is that we landed on a “magic corrupts” message rather than “power corrupts” (or something more nuanced) – not that there’s no nuance, but that seemed like the overall takeaway and I have some Opinions on it. Generally though it was great, and I agree 100% about both Colin Morgan and Harry Melling.
29th November 2020 @ 10:44 am
gosh. Right now finding the energy to shower is exhausting to me, so I cannot begin to imagine what a masters degree would do to my quarantine brain right now. Kudos to you!!!
–So that’s sad as hell.–
gosh, that IS sad as hell!!! 🙁
We’ll try and chat about this in the round up episode, but really interesting comparison and yes… WOE.
and yes, you’re completely right, it’s as simple a change as swapping ‘magic’ with ‘power’. these things are so much more frustrating when they are so easy to fix. argh.
M Xx
24th November 2020 @ 4:03 pm
Long time listener, first time commenter here. I nearly forgot that Harry Melling was in this episode, it feels like this year I’ve seen him in a lot of stuff (The Devil All The Time, The Queen’s Gambit–both American stories with a large chunk of the cast British). I’ve got a couple of brief thoughts about the episode discussion that you had. Firstly, Gilli’s ring and how it’s connected to his magic: personally I always read Gilli’s ring as his version of MCU Thor’s Mjolnir. Thor is the god of thunder and absolutely does not need a silly old hammer to access his powers, however, early Thor is impulsive and erratic, so it sort of “centres” him and helps him harness and channel his powers properly.
The second thing is perhaps a theme that does run through the entire show–Merlin’s passivity regarding Uther’s cruel prosecution of magic users. Gilli is definitely right in that scene where he calls Merlin out on it, even though the show doesn’t play it like that, but irrespective of whatever moral stakes are involved in the “glory vs respect” balance, Merlin’s actions overall hardly seem to warrant that kind of respect. He’s killed people for less than anything Uther seems to do on the regular. And I’m remember getting rather sick of them saying Arthur is ready to be king. The lad’s been ready to be king since s1e2, Uther, on the other hand, has been carrying out mindless tyranny among his subjects, systematically pursuing and executing an entire group of his subject. And in hindsight (I was a child when Merlin was actually aired), I feel very uncomfortable with what exactly the sociopolitical coding of the groups in the show implies.
I do love your podcast, keep going and can’t wait for the finale-double-episode + season-closing-one + drinking-game(?)!
29th November 2020 @ 10:39 am
The Queen’s Gambit is on our to watch list because everyone has been talking about how great it is. Harry M. being in it is just an extra reason to watch it now. yay!
— Thor is the god of thunder and absolutely does not need a silly old hammer to access his powers, however, early Thor is impulsive and erratic, so it sort of “centres” him and helps him harness and channel his powers properly.–
makes a lot of sense. I think it *has* to be about centering and funnelling power, that otherwise would just be out of control. But yeah, would have just been really good if the show had given us one instance, where Gilli was doing magic without the ring, that was just a bit messy, that would have been cool 🙂
In regards to your second point… the shows endless repetition of Arthur not being ready to be king yet and keeping Uther on the throne is probably one of its most irritating features. not because I want to get rid of Tony Head. ALWAYS want more Tony Head. But it allows them to shy away from their whole premise, which is watching a young arthur pendragon become who he needs to be become, and together with merlin unite the lands of albion and restore magic to the world… come on people, get on with it! and on the other hand we continue letting uther kill people by the dozen, and yeah, force merlin to let him “get away with it”, which is not the most comfortable position to put the viewers in.
I read this ’10 years on’ interview with the cast and crew, and Johnny and Julian talk about how it was important to them to change things up, and how a show like Merlin could very very easily fall into a formula that is the same thing every week, and they were very concious of not ever doing that, but instead keeping things fresh, keeping things lively. And I was like ‘whaaaaaa…..?’ lol like, did they create the same show that we are watching?? cause man, one of the main problems of the show is that lessons are NEVER learned and everyone repeats the exact same things week after week after week
and yes, there definitely will be our standard New Year’s Eve(ish) drinking game. We will be asking people to vote on a S3 episode in the next week or so, in preperation 🙂
M Xx
23rd November 2020 @ 3:08 am
This is one of the Merlin episodes I’ve only seen once, and watching the episode it took me a long time to figure out why. At first, I thought it was because of where it is in the season. I think this should have come before Eye of the Phoenix, there’s no reason for it not too and I had totally forgotten the Merlin Kilgarah stuff had even happened and the episode could no longer just pretend Gwen didn’t know about Morgana so they left her out. This and Love in the Time of Dragons should have been episodes eight and nine, then Queen of Hearts as episode ten, then Eye of the Phoenix at eleven, and then the finale, Gwen’s learning about Morgana would have made much more sense this way and they wouldn’t have to just ignore that she knew for three episodes, cutting her out of two of them completely.
It took me a while to figure out that this wasn’t the reason I disliked the episode. The actual reason is that this is the only episode (unless I’m forgetting something) that actually tells the viewer that magic is evil and that magic corrupts and that the only way to avoid being corrupted is by not using it or by being Emrys. I really truly hate that. Usually, the show portrays magic as a tool (I believe it’s compared to a sword somewhere, but I prefer to compare it to water. Water can be used to restore and heal, or it can drown you.), and I really like this better. I hate that the show, in this episode seems to say that accepting who you are and not hiding certain aspects of yourself from the rest of the world makes you evil. It’s only ok to have magic if you don’t use it (or if the show is named after you). Uther says magic is evil and magic corrupts all the time, but he’s often argued against. Gaius says it sometimes too, but again Merlin almost always argues. Even if no one argues, there’s always this sort of eye-roll? maybe? there’s this sense that everyone’s thinking “you’re so dumb and so wrong but I’ve had this argument a hundred times and I can’t do it today.” In this episode, Merlin doesn’t argue and actually agrees with Gaius and is then told that he is right. It’s unforgivable, in my opinion, and I’m kind of surprised it never came up.
If it had more “You can’t do magic here, and really not in front of so many people, including the kind, because someone is going to kill you.” Merlin could have been telling Gili that he had to be more careful, more subtle, the episode could have played out exactly the same way. Or Merlin could have been more “I thought you said you weren’t a killer, that this wasn’t you.”
One thing about the episode that I did really like was that Merlin totally understands the Knight’s Code. We’ve seen so much of him not understanding it and just not getting it, that’s it really great to see him understand it here. He asks about it in the beginning, and then at the end he says “You’d won, but you were going to kill the king anyway? There’s no honor in that.” It’s very knights code-esk. It sounds like something Arthur might say. I also like how Merlin only uses magic to counteract Gili’s. It’s like he’s decided that if Gili can win in his own right, without magic, then so be it.
Anyway, I hope at least some of that made sense. Probably not though.
23rd November 2020 @ 6:42 pm
I was just talking to Diane on the comments of a previous episode about the order of the show. I’d never thought about it, but there is a lot of evidence that episodes were chopped and changed about, that our listeners have brought forward over the last couple of episodes, and it’s a fascinating thought exercise that I may do during the hiatus to see if there is a different order in which the season and the story arc would make more sense. I think having the eye of the phoenix just before the double episode finale may be a bit too close, but I definitely agree that this episode and love in the time of dragon are both stand alone enough they could definitely be shuffled around.
–The actual reason is that this is the only episode (unless I’m forgetting something) that actually tells the viewer that magic is evil and that magic corrupts and that the only way to avoid being corrupted is by not using it or by being Emrys.–
it’s definitely the first one that clearly states this (not sure if it comes up again in S4 and S5, it’s been a very long time) and goes against early statements we’ve had, as early as 1×1 where Gaius says “magic isn’t good or evil, it’s how you use it” and we’ve definitely had comments about magic corrupting before, but it’s never been quite as crystal clear as (apparently) it is here.
Though I do think there is a differentiation between ‘the only way to avoid being corrupted is by not using magic at all’ and what the episode says, which is ‘the way to avoid being corrupted is by not using magic for selfish / negative purposes’. There is a distinction that is important. But yes, I agree, I’m not a fan of it being said so definitively here, and as we discussed in the podcast episode, that we don’t talk about it. like, it’s stated, and we’re just supposed to accept it. merlin says it and apparently that makes it fact. Rather than using it as an opinion on magic and the whole shebang, that we can then discuss and form opinions over, for us as viewers but also Merlin himself. Because it’s not even directly stated as his opinion, it’s Gaius’ opinion, that Merlin just agrees with, rather than talk about.
I like your water comparison, as it does give magic a different dimension than just a straight forward tool that you can use, ie a sword that can help you defend and protect, or allows you to kill, completely managed and controlled by you. What it doesn’t do, is become dangerous and kill dozens and dozens of people, if you fail to control it. Whereas the water analogy does allow for aspects of magic such as what Alice describes to us, which is that she thought she could control it, but then she couldn’t. it gives magic a force of it’s own, that can overwhelm you. and I think that element is important when we talk and think about magic.
Ultimately, unfortunately, I do think so much of the frustration in the show stems from the fact that the show didn’t at any point sit down to define what they wanted the world to be, what they wanted magic to be, and what they wanted the old religion to be, and what in all the world was the new religion in comparison… which means that we end up trying to figure out and argue over stuff and wreck our brains to try and figure out how things fit into any sort of logic… except that logic does not actually exist from the source material, and however much you squeeze and try, it won’t ever fit.
M Xx
23rd November 2020 @ 3:05 am
Hi everyone! First time commenter here. I’d like to jump in and play Merlin’s advocate. Yes, Gilli has a point. Does Uther deserve to die? I dare say he does. But as for striking a blow on behalf of magic users, Merlin has seen other sorcerers seek revenge on Uther and Camelot numerous times. Personally, I get a little frustrated that most of the magical people we see have evil or twisted intentions. I wonder if Merlin feels those magical attacks as betrayals. They certainly make it harder for him to make his case to Arthur someday for the legalization of magic.
I love how Colin says “I’m protecting you!” While it might sound like an excuse to Gilli, there is such depth of feeling in Merlin’s face and voice that I believe him to be entirely sincere. I think Merlin is trying to protect Gilli not only from revealing his magic and getting executed, but also from getting caught up in revenge or becoming a bully in order to defend himself from bullies. Also, Merlin knows what it’s like to kill. The show doesn’t always treat this seriously, but I think Merlin carries a fair amount of regret and wouldn’t wish that on anyone.
23rd November 2020 @ 6:27 am
Hi Lilith, welcome.
Thank you for making that point above: you know, that actually makes a lot of sense and has really helped me better understand that conversation between Gilli and Merlin. Yeah, Merlin has actually seen lots of magic users who have been corrupted by revenge (not by magic though) to become evil or a killer like himself and he would like to protect Gilli from becoming like that. There is even some paralleling with Morgana here to whom this has happened and who tries to get Uther killed (thankfully not through an ill-conceived and badly executed magical plot this time). If Merlin is a knight for magic, then of course, he’s trying to protect his people. We might even say trying to keep magic and magic users pure from the corruption of yearning for glory or revenge, Merlin is a priest for magic.
I just wish the show had openly taken that course instead of this semi-fabricated: oh no, you must not kill Uther because then Arthur will see (when does Arthur EVER see???) and will turn against magic forever. And Merlin’s decisioin to ‘let Gilli die’ which I still don’t get, kind of speaks against the ‘I want to protect you from becoming one of the evil sorcerers I have had to fight so often before’ as well. Well, the line in my opinion doesn’t make much sense anyway and is only trying to heighten the stakes when there is no need for it.
23rd November 2020 @ 7:45 pm
Hi Lilith!
Utterly share your frustration about every single magic user we meet being evil except for like 3 and a half across five years of the show. it so plays into watering down the message of what merlin is trying to achieve and also, why is he trying to achieve it at all, if this is what magic does to people and makes people into? frustrating as anything, because it’s clearly NOT what the show is trying to say. it’s just not stopped to think about it.
–Does Uther deserve to die? I dare say he does.–
I would agree with you. But would I want to be the one to make that decision? no, not in any way what so ever. Is Merlin able to make that decision, and live with what that makes him? And is Merlin willing to allow Gilli to make that decision, and deal with what that makes Gilli into, and in turn, what Merlin has allowed Gilli to become? that’s the kind of staff I would love for the show to explore more, because they’re the moral dilemmas that would explain to us as viewers why we’re not just killing uther already and getting on with the king arthur part of it all…. as you say, merlin carries the murders he’s had to comit with him (he must!!) and he wouldn’t wish that on anyone. I just wish the show let him explore it more often. Especially as the show is allowed to get darker in later seasons…
M Xx
22nd November 2020 @ 9:38 pm
We could never hate you! Honestly I am in constant awe of how you both manage to a fraction of everything you do, so I think it is a very good idea to modify the lessons game slightly so you can actually breathe! And speaking of amazing things you do, Maddy, I totally agree about Michelle’s art, it is beautiful.
Thank you so much for an incredible podcast episode, you made an awesome episode even awesomer! I honestly had completely dismissed this episode when I first watched it, weirdly, but recently I was completely shocked at how wonderful it is and I could not agree more with where it stand on the List of Destiny.
And to Danuta and Mary regarding your points about the music; yes, I noticed this too! It is, as you both say, intimate and I think quite tranquil, but manages to hold an excitement in the notes, a hope for the future. While the other versions are more typically “epic” with the full orchestra, the loud dynamics and a strong and powerful drive, the choice of a harp here is brilliant. It holds so much tension, each plucked note resonating and lingering, but is so gentle and unforced, sort of conveying the subtle yet powerful and sustained sheer beauty of Merlin’s magic – a presentation often overshadowed by sheer blunt force. Later, the piano feels heavy and weighted with the block chords, but still not at all intruding. I wonder if this is symbolic of the burden Merlin carries, yet cannot share. Gosh. You both really inspired me to look into that a bit closer, thanks! Freya’s theme, and the variations of that same melody are some of my favourites of the soundtrack.
Also: OH MY GOD DO I LOVE ARTHUR PENDRAGON! The performance of this episode is clearly top notch all round, Anthony Head, Harry Melling, Colin…absolutely incredible in every way and to be honest my words can’t do justice to that beautiful beautiful scene. But I was surprised how much a I loved Arthur this week, especially as last weeks wasn’t my favourite. The expression on Bradley’s face when he sees his Father stumbling and wheezing after he’s been knocked down…I was really moved. And then the look he gives Uther, on the ground with a sword pointed at his throat – not a position we see Arthur in, often – has so much peaceful authority and strength, that there is no doubt who really won this battle, regardless of who the crowd is cheering for.
23rd November 2020 @ 6:51 pm
–We could never hate you!–
YAY!! everyone has been amazingly nice and willing to jump through extra hoops to make our lives easier, which has been very very reassuring!!! lol
— I totally agree about Michelle’s art, it is beautiful.–
aww, thank you!!!
all the conversations about music here on the site always blow my mind and i just end up reading them, wide-eyed, nodding along and knowing that I will *never* be able to understand music in that way, but it’s super cool to read about it from y’all who do understand it that way
–Also: OH MY GOD DO I LOVE ARTHUR PENDRAGON!–
the only accurate response at any point in life!!!! haha
M Xx
25th November 2020 @ 10:56 pm
Of course! Anything I can do to help make things easier for you, I am very very glad too!
Honestly, so I am I, and I hope what I say makes some kind of sense even when compared to the incredible musical thoughts that happen here. But I’m fairly certain that everyone understands music in an intuitive way we just can’t always explain, and although there are words to describe that, there aren’t always! That’s one of my favourite things about music, it’s there for everybody regardless of how much terminology you know, or how good you are at it.
“–Also: OH MY GOD DO I LOVE ARTHUR PENDRAGON!–
the only accurate response at any point in life!!!! haha” Exactly! I was surprised at how surprised I was – of course I knew this to be the truth, but seem to have forgotten…not anymore!
25th November 2020 @ 11:08 pm
I can’t remember where on twitter I saw this the other week (gosh, it may have even been on our own website from one of our lovely listeners?? My quarantine brain is 90% soup unfortunately!) but someone saying that Arthur Pendragon is Bradley’s most underapreciated role… which is a crazy thought, considering it’s the role that made him famous and is still the role he’s most mentioned for I do believe it’s fair to say… but there is just this switch where suddenly everyone realised just how good Colin Morgan is (which of course he is!) and it just kind of carries you away but gosh bradley is good!!!!
22nd November 2020 @ 6:00 pm
Thank you for such a beautiful podcast dedication, especially since I have to correct myself: this isn’t one of my top episodes. This is my absolute top (I’m afraid it’s a slow downhill journey for me from this point on)! I also enjoyed that your podcast was so epically long and it taught me (this isn’t a proper lesson) that I should trust my memories a little more: There are a few Merlin episodes which I distinctly remember watching for the first time and this is one of them. When I first finished it, I knew this was going to be my favourite: the story, the acting, the questions raised – nothing was going to come close! And when I had concluded the entire series, my prediction turned out to be right. No idea why I told you last week that it might only be among the top. I’m really glad you also put it in second place.
Like Danuta and Maddy have said, you have been very thorough in discussing the episodes – and wasn’t it so fun to think about such a beautiful piece of art?
However, being me, I obviously need to do some commenting.
I wasn’t too bothered by Arthur competing in the tournament: although he says that there are no rules, the competition is still run by unspoken agreements, such as that the fight will be one on one, it will take place at a certain place and time and, interestingly, that there clearly cannot be women competitors. Probably, it is also an unspoken rule that if you kill the Prince you won’t get the reward you were hoping for but only a death sentence. Now, Uther taking part is obviously ludicrous but we do get the sense that people in Camelot and Arthur feel the same way and Uther is doing it out of stubbornness, petulance and pride.
There is another issue which bothers me much more and which, I think, is problematic throughout the entire series. You pointed out that when Merlin maintains that Gilli is ‘not a nobody…you are special’ he is referring to Gilli being special because of his magic. I find that overall, we get very little sense that people who do not have magic or royal blood or special skills or a destiny hanging over their heads are deemed worthy of making an impact, of having value in and of themselves. Since season 1, Merlin has learned that he is not a monster and that is good. But only his special birth and magic made him worthy of discovering and receiving a purpose and destiny. And when he stops wanting to be special, when he rebels against it and just wants a normal life, destiny raps him on the fingers, kills his loved ones and turns him back to his special path. Even the upcoming knights are singled out not because of simply being human but because of how special they are: they all have special skills or qualities or background stories. Elyan might be the only exception here. I guess we could say Gwen used to champion the ‘normal’ people but even she was singled out by the show from the beginning by her position in the castle, by her relationships with the royals and Merlin and since last episode, she also has a destiny of becoming Queen. Anyway, I know the show wants to say that we are all unique and all have our special gifts but I don’t think they land it well enough because we don’t really have a character that just goes about their daily business, hasn’t got any special powers, blood, destiny or position and still matters enough to make a difference.
I hope that made sense.
I believe that in this episode the show is actually on Gilli’s side but tries very hard not to be. In the magic reveal scene, I absolutely agree with Gilli and all throughout the episode I continually do not understand why we cannot let Uther die. At this point, would it really make much of a difference if he wasn’t around anymore? The show struggles to get Merlin into a position where we agree with his actions but it is all a little far-fetched. The dragon suddenly defends Uther and simply assumes that Arthur will see his father killed by magic and turn against it forever. Why? Gilli has done ostentatious magic throughout and no one has seen; why assume anyone would see now, especially with Merlin able to cover up his more reckless moments? Why does Merlin go to the dragon to discuss letting Gilli, his kin, die? As far as we are aware, Uther was never going to kill Gilli and only win or lose. I think Merlin’s decision should have been whether or not to let Gilli go ahead killing the king in magically-enhanced combat or to prevent him like he actually does. But somehow the conversation between the dragon and Merlin blows up the conflict to much bigger proportions so that we take Merlin’s side.
Later, this happens again when Merlin defends his actions by saying, ‘You had won. But you were going to kill the king anyway?’ At no point had Gilli already won the contest and just coldly went in for the kill – again, the episode is twisting the actual events to make us sympathise with Merlin’s actions – which I don’t! I agree that magic should not be used for personal glory but if it is the only special thing you can do, who can blame Gilli for just wanting affirmation and acceptance? That’s not personal glory or vanity, that’s a fundamental need of humans. Gilli takes it too far but he learns that pretty immediately. Also, I think it is time someone struck a blow for the likes of Merlin and Gilli and took revenge on Uther. Finally, after the episode has been entirely unconvincing when trying to make us take Merlin’s side, it gives Merlin the middle finger at the end when Uther says that Arthur is definitely ready to be king, meaning Uther was definitely ready to be killed!
Danuta pointed this out as well, but the use of Freya’s theme when Merlin reveals his magic is just so beautiful. But this time it isn’t swelling, orchestral and epic: it is simply the theme played on a piano, connoting the most private and intimate revelations Merlin has ever made. Also, that look Merlin gives Gilli when he shows him the flame in his palm is the best expression we will ever see from Colin Morgan. This scene makes me cry every single time. It is so complex and heart-wrenching and so deeply human! It’s my favourite scene in all of Merlin!
23rd November 2020 @ 7:15 pm
–Thank you for such a beautiful podcast dedication, especially since I have to correct myself: this isn’t one of my top episodes. This is my absolute top–
oh god, I thought you were going to say ‘turns out, on rewatch, I don’t actually much like it’ hahahahaha my heart dropped!!
–I also enjoyed that your podcast was so epically long–
you will appreciate the upcoming double episode then. it is uncomfortably long!!! lol
— and, interestingly, that there clearly cannot be women competitors. —
very very true… there are no rules, so what would happen if S2 Morgause turned up and wanted to take part….? hmmmm.
— And when he stops wanting to be special, when he rebels against it and just wants a normal life, destiny raps him on the fingers, kills his loved ones and turns him back to his special path.–
very very true. S1E1 Merlin’s statement of ‘if I can’t do magic, what even is the point of me’ should be the kind of statement that we teach him over time isn’t true, isn’t the way to think of himself, and isn’t healthy and that yeah, he’s worthy all by himself, for who he is, as a person. but instead we just figure out how he can do magic, and therefore how there can be a point to him. And yeah, as you say, the show wants to say good things about everyone being unique and special, and I think what they are trying to say is that Merlin is such a special person, in and of himself, that he is able to cope with destiny, he is able to use his magic for good, he is able to put everyone else before him for this amazing greater cause, because of who he is, not just because of who his magic makes him. As you call out Gwen is and should be the champion of the people, but she is the only person of her class that we ever meet in more detail, and by that very nature she is singled out and therefore doesn’t really work. I was also thinking about Gaius being part of the common people… except again, he keeps being given moments where he is singled out and given heroic moments, and most of them involve magic.
–I absolutely agree with Gilli and all throughout the episode I continually do not understand why we cannot let Uther die.–
other than because he’s Tony Head, NOBODY KNOWS!!!! but yes, you’re absolutely right, Gilli could kill Uther using magic, because he got to this point in the tournament and no one caught him, and no one questioned his winning to a point of investigating and finding out about his magic, so yeah, why would they now?
–I think Merlin’s decision should have been whether or not to let Gilli go ahead killing the king in magically-enhanced combat or to prevent him like he actually does.–
I think the conflic should be “simply” over whether or not to let Gilli go ahead killing… anyone. It should be about what is this going to do to Gilli. What is this going to do to Gilli’s magic. How is this going to develop, if he allows it. Would Gilli turn into another Morgana, if Merlin let him? Another Morgause? ..Is this how uther started?
merlin knows very well what it means to kill, but so far, he can excuse all of his killing as being done to protect people, only being done in reaction, only being done “for the cause”. I really wish the show talked about the simple act of killing more often. And this would have been as good a place as any, to do so.
— At no point had Gilli already won the contest and just coldly went in for the kill —
I think there’s just about a scene where the king is on the floor and Gilli moves to do… something. But yeah, it’s not as black and white as Merlin makes it out, and as it needs to be, for Merlin’s lesson.
— Also, that look Merlin gives Gilli when he shows him the flame in his palm is the best expression we will ever see from Colin Morgan. This scene makes me cry every single time. It is so complex and heart-wrenching and so deeply human! It’s my favourite scene in all of Merlin!–
have you seen the pencil drawing art of the flame in his hand? we’re talking 10 years ago fanart but shout if you haven’t and i’ll dig it up for you, it’s gorgeous!!!!
M Xx
23rd November 2020 @ 10:34 pm
oh god, I thought you were going to say ‘turns out, on rewatch, I don’t actually much like it’ hahahahaha my heart dropped!! –
Haha, no I wasn’t. But I do like to surprise people from time to time. 🙂
you will appreciate the upcoming double episode then. it is uncomfortably long!!! lol –
Golly, better buy vegetables enough to make two soups this weekend then… 😀
S1E1 Merlin’s statement of ‘if I can’t do magic, what even is the point of me’ should be the kind of statement that we teach him over time isn’t true, isn’t the way to think of himself, and isn’t healthy and that yeah, he’s worthy all by himself, for who he is, as a person. but instead we just figure out how he can do magic, and therefore how there can be a point to him. –
So, the show is basically saying that yes, you are a monster, if you use magic for anything but what destiny decrees (because people around you will drop like flies if you step a toe across the destiny line!) and yes, you are pointless, unless you are singled out and special in some way.
Once again, what a fatalistic world view. Thanks show…again. (I feel like that line is going to come up again.)
I think the conflic should be “simply” over whether or not to let Gilli go ahead killing… anyone. –
I think this might be the one failing of this episode: if they had simply trusted enough in us being invested in Gilli as a character and Merlin’s relationship to and interaction with him, if they had simplified the plot a little and didn’t bring too much destiny/ Once and Future King/ magical corruption in there, it would have worked better and thought about things more deeply.
have you seen the pencil drawing art of the flame in his hand? we’re talking 10 years ago fanart but shout if you haven’t and i’ll dig it up for you, it’s gorgeous!!!! –
I haven’t! Please…if you can find it, I’d love to see it! 😀
24th November 2020 @ 11:16 am
hahaha yes, definitely a two soup length episode!! lol
–Thanks show…again. (I feel like that line is going to come up again.)–
I feel once we hit S4 we are into the ‘thanks show…’ territory somewhat awfully deep. but simultaneously I ALSO CAN’T REMEMBER!!!! we’re flying blind from here on out! hahaha
–if they had simply trusted enough in us being invested in Gilli as a character and Merlin’s relationship to and interaction with him–
totally agree. and you wouldn’t even need us to care about Gilli (which I think we do for the most part, but his show-y quality is very Arthur S1 and designed to be a turn off, so I can see how you may not want to rely on this), but all you need to do is trust that we the audience are going to work out that Gilli is who Merlin might have become. and you don’t even need to trust us to figure it out by ourselves, because merlin says it like twice at least in the episode. it’s right there. and you sure as hell know that we care about Merlin. So yeah, strip the rest away, make it about that.
Fanart emailed 😀
21st November 2020 @ 10:47 pm
This was an amazing episode of the show and the podcast! I totally agree that the comments/ lessons need sorting out- it takes me forever to read through them and it’s of course too much for you guys every week, I did notice a shift between season 2/3 around how long the reading-comments bit was and it used to feel a lot more chilled out. Also Michelle I always love your art but the one for this episode is so good!!!! You really captured the exact emotion I saw in Colin’s scene with Harry.
Harry was just brilliant! I’ve just watched him in the Queen’s Gambit which he was also really great in and in a rather different role which is nice to see. I love the way you talk of his and Colin’s ‘mastery’ of their expression, you just break it down so well and help me to appreciate the subtlety.
I honestly don’t have so much to say, as Danuta said, you guys picked out everything I loved and didn’t- it speaks to how almost every question in this episode was well wrapped-up.
One thing I did notice was how misty Arthur’s room looks before he goes to the first round of the tournament. It creates this muffled, dream-like space which really speaks to how comfortable Merlin and Arthur are around each other, and how they can create this atmosphere to calm each other before the storm, and also how their relationship is so wholly about them and nobody else can intrude on it (except Mackenzie Crook I suppose).
LESSON ( yes, only one today!)
I love how anxious Merlin was to meet Gilli, he is so in awe of his bravery, I think this tells us about a more retributive side to Merlin- he sometimes wishes he could just take out all his frustration like Gilli has, but he quickly shakes this off and re-learns that this isn’t who he is. Gilli represents a voice in Merlin’s head that has been nagging at him to lash out or speak out, but at this point Merlin is well versed in disregarding these ideas, and is quite confident in teaching Gilli to do the same. Almost unfortunately (because Merlin could have learnt something from Gilli) Merlin learns that he hasn’t ‘forgotten who he is’ as Gilli tells him, but he confirms the reasons that he hides that person; to work towards a better future and also just because he believes it’s right not to go off after retribution and glory.
22nd November 2020 @ 2:05 am
Oh yes, I’ve also seen Harry in The Queen’s Gambit! That’s a really good show, by the way, all the cast is stellar 🙂 fully recommend it 🙂
23rd November 2020 @ 9:29 am
The Queen’s Gambit is so good!!!! I absolutely love Anya Taylor-Joy but the whole thing was so well done!
23rd November 2020 @ 7:20 pm
we’re really glad that the overall response to our change in tactic seems to have been very positive and hugely appreciate it!! And thank you for the kind words about the artwork!! <3 <3
--I honestly don’t have so much to say, as Danuta said, you guys picked out everything I loved and didn’t- it speaks to how almost every question in this episode was well wrapped-up.--
the podcast may have been INSANELY LONG (this week's not gonna be any better) but at least we covered EVERYTHING!!! hahaha
M Xx
19th November 2020 @ 5:23 pm
Thank you for another point! 🙂
I LOVE THIS EPISODE! And I love how you commented on literally everything I loved about it (basically everything between Merlin and Gilli, Arthur’s disappointment in his father’s childishness, even the subtle and in-character way Morgana is evil-ing) and more! I admire how you find the right words for my very strong and very overwhelming feelings for the show 🙂
I will try to be concise, I promise 🙂 (and the fact that I agree with you so much this week also helps 😉 )
I think the only problem I have with this episode is that in the conclusion, it feels like Gilli’s father was 100% right. I like that Gilli makes peace with him, but after all, he didn’t even defend his life with his magic, which is more than a reasonable thing to do – and given how much magic works in this show as a metaphor for many minorities, especially LGBT+, it’s somehow problematic. Concealing your gifts quite so strongly can’t be a good message of this episode…
I had quite a few musical epiphanies in this episode – as I do.
First of all, I like that you spotted the way Merlin shares his magic with Gilli is reminiscent of Freya. The music knows it too, because the Freya’s theme is played in the background, and therefore, it’s now a “magic-bonding” theme 🙂
My second musical comment will get SPOILER-y, unfortunately, but I just can’t let it go, because I literally cried when I noticed that.
So I was surprised by the theme we hear when Gilli is talking about his father, both for the first time, and then in the scene of his parting with Merlin, when Merlin tells him that one day, magic will be free. The melody that begins this theme comes back in the show from time to time (especially in the tracks called “The Call of Destiny” and “The Bond of Sacrifice”), incorporated into other themes, but it’s always in a slightly different arrangement (played on a piano, or by the whole orchestra etc.), whereas here, it’s played on a harp (harp=magic in this show at this point, I think). Well… there are, to my knowledge, literally TWO other moments when this exact theme in this exact harp arrangement will come again. First, in the season 3 finale, in the Round Table / knighting scene (I will talk about it next week), and it’s very powerful then: starts with a harp, but then a choir joins, and even a triumphant trumpet, and the theme has more time to unfold. The second time it comes back… it’s The Disir episode in season 5. In particular, THE CONVERSATION (I’m not kidding about the spoilers!) where Merlin chooses between Mordred and magic. This exact theme, which signified magic, the sense of hope for the magical community, the hope for the Golden Era during Arthur’s reign etc., is playing so perfectly in this scene until it stops abruptly when Merlin makes THE DECISION. And the fact that they linked Gilli so subtly with this, kinda reminding us that yeah, it’s also him that Merlin throws under the bus… well, this just destroyed me. It’s so clever and so cruel. Yes, you can bury me now. Sorry for that, but I couldn’t live with this pain on my own. I hope I will make up for that next week…
23rd November 2020 @ 7:40 pm
–I will try to be concise, I promise 🙂 (and the fact that I agree with you so much this week also helps 😉 )–
haha this very much seems to be the overall mood this week. the fact that we talked for FOREVER means that no one has anything left to say, because we used up ALL THE WORDS hahahah which will be absolutely the way we’ll go in this double episode finale, too. oh my god it’s already so long!!!!! lol
— Concealing your gifts quite so strongly can’t be a good message of this episode…–
definitely something we’ll talk about in the up top section!!
as always, I am simply awed and fascinated by all the music analysis, and wow, yeah, I can see how your spoiler music revelation has been keeping you up. that is utterly utterly heartbreaking!!! You’re gonna have to give me another heads up when we get there, because I will absolutely fail to notice this myself, even now that I know, but I love the analysis of it!!!
M Xx
23rd November 2020 @ 8:41 pm
Aww, thank you 🙂 Yes, I will wait patiently and definitely gonna bring it up in the future… now that I discovered it, it’ll probably stay with me forever lol 😀 THE FEELS.